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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
EHTICS
1. the body of moral principles or values governing or distinctive of a particular culture or group.
2. a complex of moral precepts held or rules of conduct followed by an individual: a personal ethic.

I have found the topic of, discussion of, and motivation for individual purpose of ethics, to be diverse and situational. I am interested to hear individual ethical interpretation.
As a baseline;

Handle all fish with care,
Leave your fishing spot cleaner than you found it,
Respect the rights of property owners and other outdoor enthusiasts,
Use the proper tackle and methods for the species being targeted,
Promote the sport by teaching children and new participants the regulations,
Become informed about your fishery and participate in its management,
Report all illegal fishing activities to the proper authorities
Respect the space of others, leave enough room for everyone to fish, and;
Learn the fishing and laws and abide by them.


Personally 1) "don't cross my line" if you do you're to close.
2) "don't let me catch you fishing illegally (see fishing regs)" I'll report you.
3) "if you can't get along leave"
Thats my baseline...whats yours.
 

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general comments without substance will dilute the topic
Wow!

I like to confront angling ethics with what I call "pressure and support" and always "with a smile." If you see something that is questionable ethically or legally, approach the person and call him/her on it. BUT, with this pressure, provide a little support by taking the time to expalin things, offer some friendly advice and maintain a smile. You won't win everyone over, but who cares. If they don't respond they just don't get it and probably never will. Don't get worked up and let it ruin your day on the water.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I don't mind teaching the new and inexperienced we all started there, some much younger than others...what ticks me off is somebody who is intentionally breaking the rules eg. A 2 fish limit = two per trip to the car. Or the people sitting in the box's off steveston jigging sockeye with 3 treble hooks on a line, flagrant violations.
 

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With all the respect to all the people who fish BC rivers and with no ofence to anybody,this is what I think.
I don't think that nonethical behaviour comes from fisherman who fish for the love of the sport,people who do so most of the time realease thier catch,respect fellow anglers,help the unexperianced to learn,keep the enviroment clean and rather have a friendly chat than fish.
I think nonethical behaviour comes from people who are out there with one and only reason, to harvest fish.
These people usually dont spend the day on the water,they are out for a couple of hours only and they will do anything it takes to fish the best piece of water before anyone else.
A nother reason is this:
Fishing licences in BC, are way to acceseble for anyone,with no bad intentions with what I just said,meaning I think there should be a written test for anyone who wants to become a angler,making sure that everyone is aware of what to do,and what the conciquences are if they dont follow the rules.Becouase I,m positive that many of people out there do what they do ,only becouase they know no better. :thumbup:
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I'd like to at least acknowledge and thank ribolovac and green machine for at least having the grapes to put there opinion out there....for all the talk and complaining on this site about ethics...200 views later and nothing...it's a great subject to use to complain about others...until you have to throw down and stick your own neck out a bit for others to see...for those of you that don't complain about the day to day actions of others this is not directed at you. However for those of you that feel it necessary to gripe about every person that did you wrong on a river...how bout putting in :2cents: to say where they would have done right by you...you know "the specific ethic that they violated by your ethical standards".... maybe if you spent more time talking about the specifics of how one that wronged you could have been in the right....think about it...just a thought :cheers:
 

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Those are some great guidlines there Sea Chaser. I have said it before and Ribolovac as said it again that there should be a course and/or test to get your license. You have to take the core program to get a hunters number to get tags so there should be a core programs to get your fishers number! The other thing that I would like to add is boat ethics that would be hand in had with fishing ethics. Boats are used in the majority of fishing even if one is fishing from shore there are those there in boats.

- mind your wake. It is and extension of your boat and can cause as much damage as physically hitting another boat
- no wake means NO wake..this is in all lakes inside 100 feet from shore marked or not and where marked otherwise
- lauching pad is for launching. Make sure the straps are off, plug is in and gear/persons are loaded before tying up the ramp.
- the launch pad and associated warfs are for launching only. no swimming, fishing, loitering or such. And keep the BS'n to a minimum when people are waiting.
- mind your anchoring. make sure you leave enough room for swing and pulling anchor, don't beek out those on shore or those anchored around you.
- when trolling with other boat around remember there are lines behind them!!!
- help when help is needed..it is your responsibility
- vessels heading down stream have the right of way always!

I'm sure we can come up with more...my :2cents:
 

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Good stuff. It may be a sign of the times, but most people seem to think more of themselves than those around them. Personally I try to live by the motto of 'leave it better than you found it'. It is really unbelievable the mess some people leave behind, especially when you would expect that they are there in the first place because they love nature.
I also second the boating ethics and the wake. As one who fishes a lot from a small paddling craft (canoe, kayak), I really appreciate it when power boaters slow down so they don't swamp me. It is hard to believe how self-centred some boaters can be - they just don't seem to notice, or care, that they are going way too fast and that they are indifferent to the havoc they are leaving behind.
 

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Hi Birdnest...just some food for thought....for some boats speeding up is better for you! With some vessels when they slow down their wake can double or triple in height and could swap you no problem. The smallest wake is at a no wake speed (ie 5 mph) and some cases this isn't possible (ie heading upstream in a 8-10 mph current) so passing at warp 2 is the best for those around especially with jets because there is hardly any wake at WOT. Just so the next time someone passes and you hear the motor pick up as he passes he is doing you a favour. However if he is just goofing off then fire at will. :cheers:
 

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The absolute baseline is the written regulations. Other considerations are more subjective. I am of two minds on helping novices. While I have taken a lot of time introducing people to fishing and guiding them through species identification, reading the water, gear selection, fish handling and cleaning, and cooking, I do not think you owe this to to strangers you see struggling on the river bank. However, if you bring a newb out, you are obliged to hold their hand through out the trip. And, if you see some one transgressing the baseline you are obliged to do something, whether it is direct confrontation or reporting the violation to authorities.

Personally, I love to release fish. But I also love to kill fish. Either way, I always treat the fish as well as possible; a quick bonk or a quick revival and release.

From time to time, lines will cross on the river. I don't freak out about this. But I have never had a guy cross my line on a continual basis.

I don't low-hole and I don't litter. But I do fish with lead.

I do not intentionally break or cut down vegetation that is interfering with my casting. And if you do that, wise up. But I do try to scare bears away.

I like a riverside chat, but not a chatterbox.

I think that, as the people on the water most often, we have a responsibility to try and influence how the fisheries are managed. But not in a self interested way. It is important that we recognize that anglers are not the only, and not the most important stakeholders. We have to recognize our own impacts and try to cooperate with other users on conservation and management issues.
 

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I think all the points made here have validity. However I am not 100% certain that having a written exam (or other means similar to CORE) to get your license is the best idea. Before everyone jumps on me, let me explain. While I do think it would be very valuable in improving fish-peoples' ethics, knowledge and skill on the water, I think it would be too much of a deterrent in getting new fisher-people into the sport. We all know that the sale of licenses is important in providing revenue to bolster the resources required to manage the fisheries and making it more difficult to obtain a license may hamper this. Oh well, it may be worth a try though.
 

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The question in response there harps is wether or not we would want the new fishers in the sport if they cannot fish ethically and will not play a part in the management of the fishery? What is the point of wanting new fishers to the sport if they won't learn and practice the rules? Numbers are great but so are fish numbers IMHO. The quality of the fisher is better than the quantity and I for one would pay more for a lisence if it ment that I had to take the course (which would charge a fee!) and keep the fishermen numbers down , but the quality up!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
OK so who's got the answers....

Lowholing?..... Approx. how many feet down stream can a guy walk out on the river an cast a line without being labeled or expected to walk upstream to ask if its ok?

Fenceposting?.....Right or Wrong....maybe its that persons favorite spot? Was he there first?

Rotational fishing? .....Seems like good method? ....yet I see guys moving quickly down river cherry picking shots into holes being fished by slower anglers on there way by?.... Right or Wrong?

Leader length....individual spacing....line test....snaring is illegal (yet just listen to the word jig???...interpretation or just plain wrong???)

I'm just scratching the surface.
 

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OK so who's got the answers....
Well I certainly don't have all the answers. Not even remotly close, ;D but I'll give you my take on what I've learnt over time as I've evolved as an angler while chasing steelhead.

Lowholing?..... Approx. how many feet down stream can a guy walk out on the river an cast a line without being labeled or expected to walk upstream to ask if its ok?
I've learnt a run is a run no matter what the length. Some runs are 50 yards long, and on some systems they are 500 yards long. If an angler is actively working his/her way down a run they get their rightfull first crack in the sweet spot. So perhaps as far down until the next run begins, not matter the length.. If a person has decided to stay put in a run and I notice it, I always ask first before jumping below. Almost everytime I get the go ahead. It comes down to a little curtiousy.

Fenceposting?.....Right or Wrong....maybe its that persons favorite spot? Was he there first?
Good questions. One key element I was taught when fishing for steelhead was to stay on the move and hit a new run if one doesn't produce. It seems in certain areas of the river over the past few winters, people have gotten away from that in favor of growing roots in one spot for the entire day hoping the fish will move through.. Sure it'll get some a few fish. However from personal experience staying on the move and covering more water will more times than not get you better results. The fence post methods tend to breed "we'd better get there earlier tomorow if you want a spot" theory. Which eventually snowballs into shoulder to shoulder combat fishing where nobody moves.

Rotational fishing? .....Seems like good method? ....yet I see guys moving quickly down river cherry picking shots into holes being fished by slower anglers on there way by?.... Right or Wrong?
It's a great method for Steelhead, and I've seen it work awesome to the enjoyment of all first hand. It gives the first comes first serves their rightfull first crack at the sweet spots in the run, and at the same time gives others a fair go as well on their way through. Sometimes it takes a bit longer than others but the intention is the same. You have to love what I call fish hogs hit a sweet spot and have multi hookups infront of everyone else and look like a hero, but refusing to move through. All the while not giving anyone else a fair crack in the run. This again can spawn the "get there earlier tomorrow" scenario, and everyone stays put the next time afraid they'll never get their chance at a hookup.

Can this work on high presure systems like the Vedder? I think so. The tough part is not everyone will buy into it. You need to have everyone sold on the concept for it to work for everyone involved. These only are my thoughts pertaining to Steelheading, and in most cases on systems like the Vedder durring the winter you have a little curtiousy and roll with it as best as possible.

Finder
 

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cascademarine said:
... wether or not we would want the new fishers in the sport if they cannot fish ethically and will not play a part in the management of the fishery?
Merely purchasing a license and subsequent tags is the most 'management' that most fisher-people do. What other 'part in the management of the fishery' do you participate in?

cascademarine said:
... I for one would pay more for a lisence if it ment that I had to take the course (which would charge a fee!) and keep the fishermen numbers down , but the quality up!
I've never had a problem with the costs associated with buying licenses and tags and would be OK with having to pay more but I am pretty sure not everyone shares these same sentiments, consider the other costs for new fisher-peoples to get in to fishing in the beginning (rods, reels, lures, etc, etc...).

However, charging more, be it through licensing and tags or by a course, does not guarantee that the quality of the fishery will go up too. On the other hand, increasing prices could remove a portion of the existing angling community and discourage new fishers in a time when numbers are declining, and numbers do matter when it comes to protecting our rights to fish.

What is the answer then... I don't know for sure, but I merely stated my opinion that making it more difficult for people to get into the sport may not be the best answer. Maybe it is a combination of things already said need to be done:
  • education in the classroom
  • teaching others on the water through active communication
  • RAPP - observe, record, report
  • posting threads like this one
  • sending a letter to parties responsible for fisheries management
  • banding together to show support for regulation change
  • etc, etc...

My :2cents:
 

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I have done this in the past (met one of my best fishing buddies this way, he was the teacher) and am trying to set it up again. Go to your local junior high school or high school and offer to help set up a fishing club for interested students. You need the sponsorship of a teacher, and the co-operation of the administration of the school, but it is a terrific way to teach young anglers the craft and the ethics of fishing. It is also a great way to get some access to a few lakes that you might not get to without a club affiliation, discounts at some local tackle shops and some tips and ideas from young anglers that you likely wouldn't spend any time listening to any other time.
 

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Merely purchasing a license and subsequent tags is the most 'management' that most fisher-people do. What other 'part in the management of the fishery' do you participate in?
That would be the proper handling of fish and respecting the rules and regs. Part of managment is in the cooperation and dedication to the rules and ethics. Managment only works if everyone plays the game.

However, charging more, be it through licensing and tags or by a course, does not guarantee that the quality of the fishery will go up too.
The charging is to allow these programs to operate, the quality of the fishery will go up with the education of the fishers. With the proper ideas of ethics and a decent understanding of the rules will cause the quality of the fisher to increase even ever so slightly. It has to be better than the guy who buys a license yet has never seen nor read the synopsis

On the other hand, increasing prices could remove a portion of the existing angling community and discourage new fishers in a time when numbers are declining, and numbers do matter when it comes to protecting our rights to fish.
This is true, and numbers do count but what happens when the mass majority of the sport fishing population is cast in an unethical light? What happens to our credibilty when fighting for our rights? If the program is done correctly the idea is to strenghten our position. It may be easier to get an opening for C&R or a full opening on specific species if the DFO had nothing to use against us. It doesn't matter that we catch a megre amount of fish next to the natives or commercial fisheries, but if we fish in a poor fashion that is all the media needs to drive the puplic vote and with it the political tendancies of the local MP and DFO. Whats better in political light; an aboriginal fishing for his family in his traditional way that is trying to be resurrected or a Hick in his SUV of a boat drinking beer snagging fish? (no offence ment just a comparison for thought :peace:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Heres a eg. of the problem...sunday I put out crab traps....when I come back to collect them, there are only 4 pots in the water...2 are mine and 2 belong to this other guy...nobody else around and as I'm going out to collect my pots...he is setting his 20ft away from mine :mad: WTF ...

eg 2....walking down the chilliwack...look down in the water....tandem barbed singles... :confused: now is'nt it supposed to be single barbless??? Anyways I hauled it out of the river and chucked it in the garbage...where it belongs.... I can't begin to explain how much that crab trap crap pi$$ed me off
 
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