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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
If a full closure is carried out on the Fraser River, how will this affect you, your business or your family? Would you support such a closure and do you feel it is necessary to rebuild runs by this method? Please, lets leave the First Nations & other parties out of this thread.........Ortho 8)
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

It won't affect me at all, I don't fish the Fraser in the summer unless I go bar fishing, which is once or twice per year... No big loss.

Cheers,
Nicole
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

I'm with Nicole, a closure won't effect me at all. I'll be fishing rivers and lakes throughout BC and Alberta for various trout species. The Fraser is the last place I want to be during the summer and early fall.
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Well I will be fishing trout, dinos below the mission bridge, bass, crappies, course fish and maybe a bit of ocean fishing. I welcome a closure to OUR salmon. Also I would support a local seal hunt. I wonder how they taste?
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Kinda sucks only because with the little ones we tend to do a fair bit of bar fishing, nothinng nicer than a big spring cooked on the beach :cheers:

That said, if it's for the good of the run. I'm all for it. :)
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

We are having a huge problem with rumors spreading across the globe and severly affecting many people trying to amke a living, including the owner of this site and many of his advertisers.

The Fraser is only closed until JUNE 15, this is to protect early run timed Chinook, which have been in decline for many years. The DFO has to close the sportsmen out if they wish to persuade the FN to slow their harvest, and then deal with the illegal poaching.
In meetings it has been very clearly SUGGESTED that we will be fishing around June 15-30.
Keep in mind that this is a "HARVEST" issue as anglers can go out and fish the Fraser right now if they chose, so PLEASE refrain from suggesting the river is CLOSED, it is not, you amy simply NOT reatain salmon at this time.

Of course DFO will be not opening sockeye this season and possibly EVER again(for obvious reasons which are many), on top of this "selective techniques" will be suggested and if we do not comply then "HARVEST" will again be closed down to protect migrating sockeye.

So the fact remains that the Fraser river IS open, just a non retention on salmon is in effect till JUNE 15.
As well as this summer Chinook opportunities in the Chilliwack and Chehalis will be open as well.

I will be putting on some " selective fishing courses" this summer to help anglers who have no idea about the many ways to catch salmon available to them. I have had many clients in the last few years who were overjoyed and quite excited to learn techniques that can catch salmon that do not involve long leaders.

I think interior lake fishing should benefit from the "harvest" closure, hopefully those people go easy on the harvesting of the rainbows.
Possibly the big lakes like Chilliwack and Chehalis will get the notice they deserve, there is a good population of large Bull trout in these lakes just waiting for a deep trolled "swim bait" , or spin n glo with a hootchie with a tip of bait.
Maybe the local Bass scene will take off, I know i plan on getting out for these scarppy fish this summer.

Its high time the salmon were given a break, but it really must start in the ocean with the commercial sector and then we can all do our part to take less. If you are not pleased with having your harvest taken away then I suggest joining a conservation group and lets put DFO to task to protect the Salmon where it counts, the ocean.

As for late summer and fall salmon fishing, grab a bar rod some spinners and spin n glos, a chair, a rod holder and a bell, head out to any bar where you can and have bounced and give bar fishig a shot. Later in the fall a flaot and jig will have your arms aching from Chum salmon fun. Lots of opportunities for the angler willing to learn this sport.
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Bent Rod

Good summary

The closure will not affect me because I concentrate on the Interior until the fall - In your opinion is closing the river good enough ??

Should we be dealing with water quality issues at the same time??

The proposed housing developement and marina at the mouth of the Adams River should do wonders for the future of sockeye in that river and through the Fraser.

How do we take a time out with everything to see what the rivers can do to bring themselves back.

Oakey
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Bent Rod.....I would like to thank you for your approach to helping anglers that floss, learn new methods of fishing instead of blasting them. I think this is by far the best approach to help reduce the amount of flossers.

People respond much better too someone trying to help them instead of blast them!!! A+
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Regardless of what is going on on the Fraser this year it wont be affecting me,i prefer to do most of my salmon fishing in the fall on smaller systems any way,i will be spending my summer fishing some of the beautiful streams and rivers in the east koots.cant wait for the warm days and some evening dry flie fishing.If having a non retention fishery for parts or all of the season on the Fraser is going to help our salmon stocks then i am for it ,but there is more than one reason our salmon stocks are declining in some runs ,all of which need to be addressed if we really want to see the runs recover.
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

Bent Rod said:
...The DFO has to close the sportsmen out if they wish to persuade the FN to slow their harvest, and then deal with the illegal poaching.
Actually the Case Law precedence has been set in this matter late last year in the form of the Supreme Court denying the Sto:lo's request for appeal in the Douglas Case. In essence, the Supreme Court has now upheld that the managers can have fisheries for other Canadians while they have the First Nations FSC closed. A tad too lengthy to go into all of the specifics here, but a quick Google search can and will verify this as fact.

Its high time the salmon were given a break, but it really must start in the ocean with the commercial sector and then we can all do our part to take less. If you are not pleased with having your harvest taken away then I suggest joining a conservation group and lets put DFO to task to protect the Salmon where it counts, the ocean.
That has already to a large extent occurred in most operations. For instance, Area G (WCVI) Troll has seen their fleet reduced dramatically, the annual quota reduced to the point that operations are approaching non-viability, have lost all access to coho and sockeye, operate under some of the strictest reporting requirements of any fleet, operate under increasingly limited openings timed to avoid stocks of concern. Yes, there are other fleets where work needs to be done for sure! But the days of huge removals are fast dwindling.

And, there are a great many of us who ply the ocean who believe once the salmon have made it to the river, that is where they should be afforded some protection.

KUDOS for your enlightened efforts to introduce the flossers to the sport of angling. Very interesting method, and as noted by "badcat", likely the right way to make a difference! :beerchug:

As for how this particular closure might affect me personally? Likely not at all, as I live, work, fish and play on the West Coast of The Rock, and have never been to the Fraser for the purpose of fishing in the summer.

Do I support this closure? Yes. When stocks are in trouble, we ALL need to recognize that, and make an effort to try and help. If that means limiting our various catches to give the resource the opportunity to try and rebuild its' former glory, then I am all for it. And would be (and have been) when that occurs in my own back yard.

Necessary? If the stocks are in as tough shape as most perceive, we GOTTA try something! Anything that reduces removal rates is worth a try...

Cheers,
Nog
 

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Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

fishortho said:
If a full closure is carried out on the Fraser River, how will this affect you, your business or your family? Would you support such a closure and do you feel it is necessary to rebuild runs by this method? Please, lets leave the First Nations & other parties out of this thread.........Ortho 8)
I'll be spending more time in the salt this year.

LL
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: How will a full closure affect you this summer

I am not posting this to feed the suggested "rumour mill". I am wanting to know how members will be affected if the Fraser were closed fully to all at any time of the year I am not mentioning any dates or times. If the river is closed, I am presuming some of our full time guides (on this site and others)would either find other work or untilize their skills in other areas like the Lilloett, Pitt,Stave/Harrison/Harrison Lake/ Chilliwack Lake etc. Without a Fraser fishery for all species, we know some of the resorts & lodges & tackle shops would take a hit, but that is not what I am asking.
A lot of sportsfishers that pack the river are likely going elsewhere with very little fanfare. I find it a bit ironic that in today's paper the government wants to promote fishing, especially for kids in BC, but at the same time , is exploring the possibilities of a closure on one of the biggest salmon rivers in the Province..........Ortho 8)
 

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I have decided not to renew my guide license this year..After 5 years I need a break and my two teenagers need dad around a bit more .
I will be spending more time fishing in the salt,interior lakes and lots of fall hunting...
I will still be out on the Fraser probably a lot as usual,but will not be having any paying clients(just kids and friends).
Sturgeon fishing is still a passion with us and I intend to keep that up, hopefully they don't shut that down too...
 

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I plan to do some more exploring in our interior so this shouldnt affect me. only time i ever fish the fraser is for some socks then im done, oh and i spend hours in a boat attempting to catch a sturgeon :happy: one day i will get one :wallbash:
 

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Just to clear up my post, I am concerned that words such as "closure" , "full closure" and the like can travel very fast in the fishing world. I have received in the neighborhood of 20 e-mails asking me if it is true that the Fraser is closed to salmon fishing this season. This concerns me greatly.

My business is mostly taking out European anglers for catch and release salmon fishing and a "harvest" closure in no way effects this, so having rumors out there about closures scares me.

Iron Noggin, clearly not much protection is being given to Fraser salmon that I can see. We have some west coast closures on commercials and what else??. Is there a proposed reduction in sport anglers ocean limits??.
Have the Alaskans and many lodges along the coast been made to play ball.

If it were as easy as stopping a few thousand Chinook from being caught in the Fraser, we would not be in this mess. We have over harvested salmon for far too long and we are about to pay the piper.
On the Fraser our limit is 1 Chinook per day, possession 2 and most angler groups are not limiting out with "sport" fishing techniques. Had there been a reasonable reduction in ocean intercepted fish by all sectors perhaps we could experience that.
Most importantly ample numbers could make the redds and we could all benefit.

As for the decision by the judges, this is great that it allows DFO to still manage fisheries and have a "sport" opening, what you are clearly missing is the fact that FN have serious quotas of food/ceremonial fish and these are the ones that I am speaking to when I speak of the sport closure helping DFO curtail these fisheries.

While FN are entitled to these fish, managers are hoping that FN will forgo the qoutas for the sake of saving the runs.

An interesting thing for all to realize here is that the Columbia River is on fire right now for early run Columbia springers, limits are the norm and its the best early run in years. Keep in mind that these are the dreaded hatchery fish that the "eco nazis" are afraid of but that river is plugged with them and will we see the same??(not hatchery fish of course because we do not need those ::)
Possibly it will be good for early Chinook and with the early "harvest closure" here maybe enough will make the redds to seed a future run. Although with extremely poor habitat in interior waters can we expect much??.
 

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Bent Rod said:
... Iron Noggin, clearly not much protection is being given to Fraser salmon that I can see. We have some west coast closures on commercials and what else??. Is there a proposed reduction in sport anglers ocean limits??.
Have the Alaskans and many lodges along the coast been made to play ball.
The closures on the WC Commercial sector have been building for many years. Area G was simply an example. Most commercial fleets have been quite seriously cut back in the numbers of vessels, as well as their related quotas. This year most will face amongst the hardest hit in recent years, and this easily represents the hardest hit to any Canadian sector. Will that be enough? Any-one's guess, but it is the type of steps you appear to desire.

The reduction amongst the recreational sector was one that was discussed ad nauseum between DFO and the SFAB of late. There will be terminal restrictions, and a coast-long "corridor" which is presumed to afford escalated protection for Fraser origin fish. So, yes, concessions have been made.

Alaska, much to a great many's bewilderment, has cut their all sector quota for springs by 48%. Many of us are left to wonder just why the Renegade State would cave in to pressure from the Treaty process, but it very much appears they have:
http://www.seafa.org/?p=280
Hopefully this will afford some relief to not only the Fraser, but many of the other southern-origin stocks facing problems of late!

We have over harvested salmon for far too long and we are about to pay the piper.
Absolutely.

Had there been a reasonable reduction in ocean intercepted fish by all sectors perhaps we could experience that. Most importantly ample numbers could make the redds and we could all benefit.
And therein is the thrust of this year's planning. Sincerely hope it works!!

As for the decision by the judges, this is great that it allows DFO to still manage fisheries and have a "sport" opening, what you are clearly missing is the fact that FN have serious quotas of food/ceremonial fish and these are the ones that I am speaking to when I speak of the sport closure helping DFO curtail these fisheries.
Nope, not missing a thing here actually. The Douglas case was based directly upon a FN Band claiming FSC rights to a diminished stock, and pressing the point due to the fact DFO allowed a recreational opening. Exactly the matter you refer to. Legal opinions now suggest that "management" cannot be held prisoner by FN groups as to force openings for FSC fish, despite active recreational openings, and this may be expanded upon to include commercial.

I am very much aware of the removal rate that occurs as a consequence of FN activity, but chose to align with the originator of this thread, and not turn this into yet another FN bash.

While FN are entitled to these fish, managers are hoping that FN will forgo the quotas for the sake of saving the runs.
Not too likely IMHO.

I have a couple of good Buddies currently fishing the bounty on the Columbia, and the situation is very much as you've noted. Some possible reason for optimism.

Yes, these are sad and dire times for the salmon. Many face the edge of the precipice as to survival. Time for all of us to band together and do what is right for the sake of these precious stocks. And by saying that, I do mean all of us. Hopefully including FN groups.

Will these steps be enough? Only time will tell. And although I very much feel for those amongst the hardest hit, reducing impact is, at this time, right up there amongst the only viable options.

Cheers,
Nog
 

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Hey Bent Rod and Iron Noggin, maybe you guys should take this outisde ;D

Seriously though, Ortho was just asking a question in which he said lets keep the 'other groups' discussion out of this.
 

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No one knows steelheadsushi,

but if it is, it won't be until after June 15th. Check the regs closer to that date.
 

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im with prof. the last place i want to be is on the fraser during a sockeye run.give me a nice quiet interior lake any day.a couple hours driving and im in heaven.the goons can have the fraser.ive been swamped by those jets one too many times.
 
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